Kyle,
We did it for weight savings. It has been proven as a great modification based on some of the OE testing we did with AEM recently.
Suspension is a key performance component in any decent vehcile build. Progress has been the suspension facility of choice for all Bisimoto Engineering projects, and many successful road race, time attack, drag and salt flat teams in the US and overseas. Time and time again Progress Technology products are being used on winning teams in the numerous sanctioning bodies, IMSA, IDRC, SCCA, NASA, SCTA, IDRA, World Challenge, and Honda Challenge.
The Bisimoto Engineering WagoVan was graced with the Progress Series I coil-over kit. The “easy to install” coil over system is the perfect balance for the performance minded enthusiast looking to make huge improvements in handling and appearance where quality, durability, and proven track performance is of the utmost value. The aggressive suspension tune is ideal for superior street performance, light drag and autocross applications. The stockers, were far from optimal for my build:
The Series I exclusive take-apart dampers are tunable and rebuild-able; in addition, the threaded steel bodies are plated with attractive corrosion-resistant electroless nickel. This kit gave us the ride height adjustments we desired, ideal for on the track or at the show. The average Honda enthusiast will love the fact that these kits are covered under a one year warranty to protect them from any defects in workmanship or parts failure.
Cut out/away view:
Progress creates and calibrates the dyno curves in all the coil-overs designed utilizing an in-house shock dyno, and matches the spring rates to optimize performance and ride compliance.
All sport spring designs are painstakingly designed in-house and extensively tested to meet exacting standards. Below is a dyno chart of the Bisimoto wagon's rear shock(s):
An obvious weak point on the EE suspension was the skinny OEM sway bar. On spirited driving days, I would love to prevent traction robbing “lean” that rolls part of the outside tires off the pavement. Progress Sport-tuned Anti-roll bars came to the rescue: replacing wimpy OEM bar and rubber bushings with larger diameter (stiffer) alloy steel bars and polyurethane bushings. More roll stiffness means less body "lean", and the Toyo tires stay flatter on the pavement (larger contact patches). The result is more grip and added driver control!
After over two decades of abuse, the rear trailing arms were in a horrible state, with cracks to boot.
Out they went:
They had to be torched out:
New progress bushings pressed in:
Progress Civic rear trailing arm bushings are high durometer, polyurethane replacement bushings to minimize deflection, and replaced our wagon stockers. These are popular for the Civic / CRX racing applications. These SCCA & NHRA legal components respond instantly to driver input and maintain suspension geometry under load, making them the ideal choice for demanding drag and road racing use.
Another set of cost effective and excellent upgrades from Progress Technology were their front and rear lower control arm bearings. These are zero-deflection control arm solid bushings that are popular for the Civic racing and hot street applications. The all-metal pivot bushings replace soft OEM rubber parts with spherical bearings. These bushings are machined for direct replacement fit with no machining required for installation.
The balance of the suspension rubber was replaced by the Energy Suspension Hyper-flex master set bushings, for the 1988-91 civic/crx. Energy suspension offers patented front-to-rear coverage for most import and domestic vehicles, with the largest product line in the industry. The kit even has a shifter bushing set, which gave an amazing positive feel to the Skunk 2 short shifter mechanism used in the Bisimoto Wagon. Honestly, if you plan on modifying, restoring an old one like we are, or even building a car from scratch, the Hyper-flex system is highly recommended.
After all was said and done, the wagon was corner balanced, and without driver and fluids weighed in at a healthy 2288 pounds.
With all fluids in place, and with me at the helm, the wagon ballooned to 2591 pounds! The front corners settled in within 7 pounds, and the rears within 11 pounds: a well balanced setup.
those bushing kits from energey suspension are awsome they replace every peice of rubber in your car i cant wait to get a set for mine. this car is just amazing...... we had a lil civic wagon meet yesterday and yer name was brought up a few times for being part of the reason why so many peeps atleast up in the greater northwest are killing for civic wagons these days. charbs wallet wants to kick u in the nuts he cant find a decently priced wagon anywhere. but for real the wagon looks amazing i hope to see it someday in person keep up the good work!
I don't know if you've experienced this before, or if you ever will, but the Poly trailing arm bushings can lead to unpredictable handling. I have been autocrossing EFs for 13-14 years now, and the polyurethane is not sufficiently compliant to allow for all the OEM intended movement (both rotation and plunge) in the rear trailing arm, and some binding will create unwanted handling characteristics from the rear suspension. I personally have experienced it, as have many others that race EFs. Honda have OEM replacement bushings available that are now slightly harder durometer than the OEM ones that shipped with the cars when they were built. Some have said that they are identical durometer (my OEM calibrated twist test proves this 8) ) to the Mugen Hard replacement bushings sold some years ago. Should you decide to change from the poly and want to go to something else aftermarket, I suggest one of the spherical bearing RTA kits that have become available in the last couple years.
When you corner weighed the car, are you confident that the numbers on the scale in the photo you posted above were somewhat accurate? I'm looking at the fr/rr weight distribution, and pleased to see the 56/44 split. Do you have an unusual amount of equipment in the back of the car (other than the AEM stuff and the spare)? Are you rear seats still in the car? I'm trying to get as close as possible to 50/50, as my build is RWD only, and that would help the handling immensly.
I've heard rumors that the spherical bearings on the rear trailing arms wear out fairly quick? Not sure if it was just one of the first designs that was released. Have you heard anything like that?
just a thought....700whp....don't think bisi will be planning on trying to autocross with this car, my guess would be straight line, those trailing arm bushings he's using might be more practical given his setup.
the lip is a modded j racing style lip for the EF hatch like I said I had this lip like 3 years ago and sold it on here to a member who was going to copy them and sell them
sorry Bisi had to let the cat outta the bag. so how's the old f series eg doin? guess gotta stop by n say hi..
Would the coils you are using have a better chance of correctly igniting the intake charge since they have 4 times as long to re-charge between firings? The OEM distributor setup requires the coil to charge/fire 4 times for every 2 engine revolutions. The COP setup only needs each coil to charge once per 2 revolutions. Would OEM Honda COP coils like the ones used in the D17 be the same specification as the ones AEM are selling? What about if it was a wasted spark setup where the COP coils fired twice per 2 revolutions?
There's a COP setup being marketed for use with the OEM configured Honda ECU. It uses the OEM distributor for signals to the ECU, and then has a firing system to run 4 individual coils that look suspiciously like the ones used by Honda. I'm wondering if it would be a useful upgrade for my high boost supercharged setup. I know I needed to upgrade to MSD when I first started running my setup, as I was suffering from spark blow out when the boost got up above 12-13 psi. Once I wired in the MSD, everything was fixed.
all this HP into a wagon & still has rear drum brakes...
The rears dont do a hell of a lot on the track, in my cars ive never upgraded rear brakes, always just the front and never had a problem. I go through 2 sets of front pads for every pair of rear
why does this seem like an advertisement...... :roll:
People are always asking guys that have really well built cars what there setup is. Now here Bisi tells you, step by step with pics, what his is and you think it is just an advertisement. :roll:
I talked to Bisi at the track a few years ago when he was running his CRX. He took all the time in the world to answer all my questions and then some. Took us over to the trailer and show us exactly what he was talking about in regards to how the motor was set up. Try that with most racers. They pretend like you are not even there.
why does this seem like an advertisement...... :roll:
People are always asking guys that have really well built cars what there setup is. Now here Bisi tells you, step by step with pics, what his is and you think it is just an advertisement. :roll:
I talked to Bisi at the track a few years ago when he was running his CRX. He took all the time in the world to answer all my questions and then some. Took us over to the trailer and show us exactly what he was talking about in regards to how the motor was set up. Try that with most racers. They pretend like you are not even there.
just seems like every product used on the car is getting special attention.
Comments
Awesome build...on a side note i work for Alcoa so even more awesome!
if the exhaust reaches over 900 degrees your tubing will begin to start warping and turn into aluminum oxide.
We did it for weight savings. It has been proven as a great modification based on some of the OE testing we did with AEM recently.
Suspension is a key performance component in any decent vehcile build. Progress has been the suspension facility of choice for all Bisimoto Engineering projects, and many successful road race, time attack, drag and salt flat teams in the US and overseas. Time and time again Progress Technology products are being used on winning teams in the numerous sanctioning bodies, IMSA, IDRC, SCCA, NASA, SCTA, IDRA, World Challenge, and Honda Challenge.
The Bisimoto Engineering WagoVan was graced with the Progress Series I coil-over kit. The “easy to install” coil over system is the perfect balance for the performance minded enthusiast looking to make huge improvements in handling and appearance where quality, durability, and proven track performance is of the utmost value. The aggressive suspension tune is ideal for superior street performance, light drag and autocross applications. The stockers, were far from optimal for my build:
The Series I exclusive take-apart dampers are tunable and rebuild-able; in addition, the threaded steel bodies are plated with attractive corrosion-resistant electroless nickel. This kit gave us the ride height adjustments we desired, ideal for on the track or at the show. The average Honda enthusiast will love the fact that these kits are covered under a one year warranty to protect them from any defects in workmanship or parts failure.
Cut out/away view:
Progress creates and calibrates the dyno curves in all the coil-overs designed utilizing an in-house shock dyno, and matches the spring rates to optimize performance and ride compliance.
All sport spring designs are painstakingly designed in-house and extensively tested to meet exacting standards. Below is a dyno chart of the Bisimoto wagon's rear shock(s):
An obvious weak point on the EE suspension was the skinny OEM sway bar. On spirited driving days, I would love to prevent traction robbing “lean” that rolls part of the outside tires off the pavement. Progress Sport-tuned Anti-roll bars came to the rescue: replacing wimpy OEM bar and rubber bushings with larger diameter (stiffer) alloy steel bars and polyurethane bushings. More roll stiffness means less body "lean", and the Toyo tires stay flatter on the pavement (larger contact patches). The result is more grip and added driver control!
After over two decades of abuse, the rear trailing arms were in a horrible state, with cracks to boot.
Out they went:
They had to be torched out:
New progress bushings pressed in:
Progress Civic rear trailing arm bushings are high durometer, polyurethane replacement bushings to minimize deflection, and replaced our wagon stockers. These are popular for the Civic / CRX racing applications. These SCCA & NHRA legal components respond instantly to driver input and maintain suspension geometry under load, making them the ideal choice for demanding drag and road racing use.
Another set of cost effective and excellent upgrades from Progress Technology were their front and rear lower control arm bearings. These are zero-deflection control arm solid bushings that are popular for the Civic racing and hot street applications. The all-metal pivot bushings replace soft OEM rubber parts with spherical bearings. These bushings are machined for direct replacement fit with no machining required for installation.
The balance of the suspension rubber was replaced by the Energy Suspension Hyper-flex master set bushings, for the 1988-91 civic/crx. Energy suspension offers patented front-to-rear coverage for most import and domestic vehicles, with the largest product line in the industry. The kit even has a shifter bushing set, which gave an amazing positive feel to the Skunk 2 short shifter mechanism used in the Bisimoto Wagon. Honestly, if you plan on modifying, restoring an old one like we are, or even building a car from scratch, the Hyper-flex system is highly recommended.
After all was said and done, the wagon was corner balanced, and without driver and fluids weighed in at a healthy 2288 pounds.
With all fluids in place, and with me at the helm, the wagon ballooned to 2591 pounds! The front corners settled in within 7 pounds, and the rears within 11 pounds: a well balanced setup.
I don't know if you've experienced this before, or if you ever will, but the Poly trailing arm bushings can lead to unpredictable handling. I have been autocrossing EFs for 13-14 years now, and the polyurethane is not sufficiently compliant to allow for all the OEM intended movement (both rotation and plunge) in the rear trailing arm, and some binding will create unwanted handling characteristics from the rear suspension. I personally have experienced it, as have many others that race EFs. Honda have OEM replacement bushings available that are now slightly harder durometer than the OEM ones that shipped with the cars when they were built. Some have said that they are identical durometer (my OEM calibrated twist test proves this 8) ) to the Mugen Hard replacement bushings sold some years ago. Should you decide to change from the poly and want to go to something else aftermarket, I suggest one of the spherical bearing RTA kits that have become available in the last couple years.
When you corner weighed the car, are you confident that the numbers on the scale in the photo you posted above were somewhat accurate? I'm looking at the fr/rr weight distribution, and pleased to see the 56/44 split. Do you have an unusual amount of equipment in the back of the car (other than the AEM stuff and the spare)? Are you rear seats still in the car? I'm trying to get as close as possible to 50/50, as my build is RWD only, and that would help the handling immensly.
jaker, experience with these?
sorry Bisi had to let the cat outta the bag. so how's the old f series eg doin? guess gotta stop by n say hi..
get your wagon done then..
i haven't seen any updates lately.
it's gourmet time...
Would the coils you are using have a better chance of correctly igniting the intake charge since they have 4 times as long to re-charge between firings? The OEM distributor setup requires the coil to charge/fire 4 times for every 2 engine revolutions. The COP setup only needs each coil to charge once per 2 revolutions. Would OEM Honda COP coils like the ones used in the D17 be the same specification as the ones AEM are selling? What about if it was a wasted spark setup where the COP coils fired twice per 2 revolutions?
There's a COP setup being marketed for use with the OEM configured Honda ECU. It uses the OEM distributor for signals to the ECU, and then has a firing system to run 4 individual coils that look suspiciously like the ones used by Honda. I'm wondering if it would be a useful upgrade for my high boost supercharged setup. I know I needed to upgrade to MSD when I first started running my setup, as I was suffering from spark blow out when the boost got up above 12-13 psi. Once I wired in the MSD, everything was fixed.
The rears dont do a hell of a lot on the track, in my cars ive never upgraded rear brakes, always just the front and never had a problem. I go through 2 sets of front pads for every pair of rear
truthfully decent and honest explained ???
or ??? nahh...
eye ...
:shock:
usually smile at adjectives...
and ...
some pictures appear to
be very goodylickedilicious...
maybe it's also his job...
dunno...
I talked to Bisi at the track a few years ago when he was running his CRX. He took all the time in the world to answer all my questions and then some. Took us over to the trailer and show us exactly what he was talking about in regards to how the motor was set up. Try that with most racers. They pretend like you are not even there.
just seems like every product used on the car is getting special attention.