4wd on 3rd gen

broodybroody New Wagonist
in Engine & Drivetrain
Hi, from what I've read here rt-4wd wagons (4th gen) can have close to 50% of power to the rear wheels, but on red pepper racing (3rd gen board) faq they say; "The Honda 4WD only sends 10% of the engine power to the rear wheels"

http://www.redpepperracing.com/wiki/ind ... _my_CRX%3F

Is that true, or the guy is wrong and the 3rd gen is working about the same (close to 50/50 possible) as a 4th gen?

Thank you. Hope I didn't buy "the wrong one".

Comments

  • The_HeadThe_Head familEE
    From what I read about the viscious coupler in the FSM, The RT4WD is just a normal FWD car 99% of the time. Power only goes to the rears when the fronts are spinning.

    Someone correct me if I misread the FSM.
  • broodybroody New Wagonist
    Yeah I know the real time is fwd as long as it's not slipping, but when it is, will the 3rd gen put as much as 49% to the rear or much less?
  • JakerJaker familEE
    If the front wheels slip, any and all remaining power goes to the back wheels. If the front wheels are in a 100% slip situation (Ice, no front axles, broken front diff spider gears, no front wheels, etc...) then 100% of the power goes to the back wheels. This is how you make a RWD Civic!

    The internals of the gearbox are 100% pure mechanical. Gears, plain and simple. The drive to the back wheels is slightly underdriven in relation to the front, so if the fronts slip, once the viscous coupler locks (almost instantaneously) the power goes to the back wheels.
  • broodybroody New Wagonist
    Oh really? I was pretty sure it's 50% max. And its really the same on 3rd and 4th gen?
    thanks

    and rwd, for 2 days before the cv joints are shot :D, and with 60whp...
    Also, actually when I park (enough cheap winter tires) in slush/snow/ice I feel like the 4wd isn't working that great, but on snow with some speed(like 10kmh, jsut nt stopped) then it looks to work well, nice traction and drift.
  • JakerJaker familEE
    The operating principles of the 3rd gen are the same as the 4th gen. In fact, the mechanicals are more or less identical in the way they function.
  • leWolfleWolf Senior Wagonist
    So wait, removing the front axles makes it RWD and it wont damage anything? What about drifting? Could I ask about how well the Automatic responds to removing the front axles?
  • broodybroody New Wagonist
    Maybe it would work but with some transmission loss and it won't last long I guess the rear axle cannot support 100hp.
  • Eagle BeagleEagle Beagle familEE
    you're talking asymmetric 4WD systems...
    it's a common ratio...
    and even if it only distributes that amount
    of torque...
    you will have improvements up to 50%
    compared to a 2wd system...

    torque engineered to...
    re-establish overall traction


    ...
  • HaydzHaydz Moderator
    broody wrote:
    Maybe it would work but with some transmission loss and it won't last long I guess the rear axle cannot support 100hp.

    100% (or as close as possible to) of the torque travels to the rear wheels if you really get the fronts spinning. Wagon rear axles are beefier than CRV rear axles.

    I suggest you read through Jakers RWD thread.
  • Tatty90EE4Tatty90EE4 Wagonist
    Jaker wrote:
    If the front wheels slip, any and all remaining power goes to the back wheels. If the front wheels are in a 100% slip situation (Ice, no front axles, broken front diff spider gears, no front wheels, etc...) then 100% of the power goes to the back wheels. This is how you make a RWD Civic!

    The internals of the gearbox are 100% pure mechanical. Gears, plain and simple. The drive to the back wheels is slightly underdriven in relation to the front, so if the fronts slip, once the viscous coupler locks (almost instantaneously) the power goes to the back wheels.

    That's weird.. The 3 bolts for the intermediate shaft had come out and my driver's axle came out of the tranny and I had no power to the rear. When I gave it throttle it would just rev up and not move the car at all. Any ideas on why this would happen??

    (bolts have been replaced since then)
  • broodybroody New Wagonist
    I tried in snow, I feel like it's not working good, on a lift all wheels will spin, I think I have some power in the rear, but not as much as it should or not enough to spin all wheels in most cases, maybe my viscous coupler is almost gone?
    And do you know if 1987 2wd wagovan front shock absorbers will fit a 4wd bolt on? I plan to get 2wd wagovan kyb gr2 (no more oem honda), will these need some fittement work and do I need the kyb strut mount (like 35$ each)?
    thanks.
  • JakerJaker familEE
    Talk to TurboTeg about how his car drove when he had no front axles in his 4WD CRX. Watch the videos of him dropping the clutch on it in his driveway. He also talks about loosing the rear end around a corner.

    Now, mind you his driveshaft was welded solid. He had no viscous coupler. So maybe the viscous coupler can't handle all that torque/power (completely open front drive).
  • broodybroody New Wagonist
    Bah, if the problem is really my coupler, I guess I could weld it to get 50/50. There is a 4wd in a scrap yard fairly far from my house (170 miles), I didn't wanted to get there but as I need more than one part maybe I'll drive there and get all what I need, but still, in winter the car is probably under 4 feet of snow.
  • Eagle BeagleEagle Beagle familEE
    sux ey...
    sure ab. correct oil and quantity...

    ?
    no
    :mrgreen:
  • broodybroody New Wagonist
    oil in the coupler? How do I check?
  • JakerJaker familEE
    I've never tried myself, but the Helms Manual says "not serviceable". There's no openings. It's a sealed unit.
  • Eagle BeagleEagle Beagle familEE
    viewtopic.php?f=7&t=738

    viewtopic.php?f=16&t=5382

    viewtopic.php?f=7&t=4949

    one of these...

    somewhere...

    :mrgreen:
  • broodybroody New Wagonist
    Finally the problem wasn't my car, it was on 2wd. The guy when he sold me the car show me the tranny switch (but it was dark and I could not find it actually) and he told me it was in 4wd. And yesterday morning with the sun and my spare tranny to check where it is on the housing, I found it and the switch was in 4wd engaged, reffering to the sticker under the hood, before getting the car to my friend with a welder and check for everything/maybe weld it I just put it on left (what it thought was 2wd) and it was working well... So I dunno if it's because the guy swapped the engine (he did) and put something wrong or from a different version, or just the sticker, but anyways I'm happy, 4wd and nokian hakkapelita 5 on snow, with low power of civic, it launches like on tarmac :mrgreen:
    but i'm angry, I went t buy front cv joints to a rebuild shop and they gave me the wrong ones :(
  • jaroszjarosz Band Wagon
    Hi
    I want delate clutch visco it's good indea??
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