Sonem EF hydro conversion kit install

turbo_tegturbo_teg Council Member
in Engine & Drivetrain
DOESNT WORK!

but...... i called the guys up and ive gotta send them my pedal assembly and bracket i bought from them and they are gunna make it work for the wagon pedal assembly. they said nothing about different EF's but when i was talking to jeremy he did say that some have a slight difference but mine was WAY off. super nice guys gunna make it work for free thank god cuz im already about $300 into parts beetween the new pedal assemply slave cylinder ect ect..... im kinda pissed ive only driven the wagon about 30 miles since i got it from shenrie before i got tired of the hasport hydro conversion kit which is garbage no one ever buy it!
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Comments

  • ogwagonogwagon Wagonist
    I know exactly what you're talking about. I also bought the Sonem kit and had the same issue.
    I looked at several different EF pedal assemblies before buying the kit and I realized the wagon clutch pedal portion is very different from all the others. The clutch pedal pivot point on a wagon's pedal assembly sits about an inch and a half further back(closer to the firewall) than all other EF's. The Sonem bracket mounts to this pivot point, there lies the problem. Knowing this I emailed the guys at Sonem and asked about their return policy in case the bracket didn't fit. They said buy and try it. If it doesn't fit they'll take it back as long as it's not scratched or damaged. Cool on their part I thought! Long story short, I bought the kit and sure enough it did not fit. Instead I decided to use the conversion bracket on a pedal assembly I got from an EX sedan I got at the junkyard. The Ex and SI pedal assemblies are more reinforced around the clutch pedal pivot point which is a known weak point and known to crack. I then used 1/8 thick steel plates to further reinforce the EX pedal assembly before mounting the bracket.
    Seemed like a good solution to me. We'll see how it turns out. Just to let you know, you may also have to trim the conversion bracket to get it to fit properly under the steering column reinforcement.
    You may also want to change the position of the washers before you weld them to the "hook"
    portion at the top of the clutch pedal to ensure a nice straight stroke on the master cylinder.
    If not, you may experience a hard clutch pedal or binding due to the awkward angle. Good luck with your project and keep as posted on your progress!
  • turbo_tegturbo_teg Council Member
    the messed up thing is i went to the junkyard and bought a new pedal assembly and i just so happen to be out of a wagon... wish i would have gottom one from a rex or hatch then it would be back together. oh well they will have it all tomarrow and are gunna make it work..... if hydro swaps start to become more commin in wagons they should be noting they are different and with my wagon pedal assebly at there shop this would be a good time to make a jig for future orders.
  • turbo_tegturbo_teg Council Member
    Well finally got a chance to work on it. sonem ended up telling me they wouldnt build me a bracket so i just made my own and saved $150. for some reason my pix arent letting me load them up on my comp or i would show whats up. the pedal assembly is ready to go back into the car works perfect cant wait to get her in tomarrow.
  • ogwagonogwagon Wagonist
    Post pics soon. I'm anxious to see what you came up with. I haven't had time to install mine yet because I've had to work weekends lately. Maybe next weekend I'll have time.
  • turbo_tegturbo_teg Council Member
    ill use my real camera today not just my cell phone should work fine.
  • turbo_tegturbo_teg Council Member
    well after days of trial and error i went back to the hasport cable to hydro set-up. there just isnt enough space under the dash to mount the master cylinder the way i want to. so i put the pedal assembly in and braced everything way more that it needed. now it feels a lot better nothing flexes what so ever and i get full engage and disengage. its still stiff and will prolly stretch and snap cables but its a necessary evil.
  • ogwagonogwagon Wagonist
    What exactly didn't fit? Did you still attempt to use the Sonem kit or did you try to make your own bracket? I previously made my own hydro conversion kit using a reverse swing clutch pedal/master cylinder combo from CNC brakes. It has actually worked out pretty good but I wanted to try the Sonem kit to see if it feels more like stock.
    That's why I was interested in your solution. I also tried the Hasport conversion and could never get it to fully engage/disengage the clutch. Then I tried the Innovative Mounts kit w/remote mounted master cylinder but the pedal was extremely hard and eventually ended up cracking my pedal assembly. Keep in mind I am running an ACT heavy duty pressure plate w/6 puck rigid disc. A friend of mine also tried the Innovative conversion kit w/remote master cylinder and had good results. He was using a Tilton single disc clutch on a track only Crx and the pedal felt just a little harder than stock. I will attempt the Sonem kit install in the near future and will hopefully have better luck.
  • turbo_tegturbo_teg Council Member
    i just couldnt get the master to fit and keep the heater tubes stock. i sent back sonems bracket and attempted making my own i made 2 or 3 but just coundt get the fit i wanted. i just coundt stand the idea of when i crank on my heater and i get nothing out of the drivers side vent......

    soooooooo i braced the bracket realy good if it breaks ill shit a brick. i then braced the pedal itself. if anyone has ever seen a pedal assembly u can see the clutch pedal has 2 adjustments that let u adjust how much the pedal can travel up and down. i backed the one off so the pedal is fully up when my foot isnt on the pedal then i completely cut off the other adjuster that is suposed to stop the pedal from getting pushed to the floor. then i adjusted the clutch cable so it has just a tiny bit of play so i know its 100% disengaged when my foot is off the pedel. i get 100% disengagement and 100% engagement and adsolutely no flexing in the pedal of the pedal assembly. i will msot likely still snap and stretch cables but oh well ill just be sure to keep a spare in the trunk space next to my spare coil, ignitor, and main relay (something all honda guys should have)
  • turbo_tegturbo_teg Council Member
    BTW i have a brand new slave cylinder, braided line, fluid resivoir, rubber line, and new master cylinder (mounting taps cut off and new holes drilled for mounting in smaller space), and fitting adapters if anyone wants to attempt there own ef hydro swap i have no plans of ever doing it i think i have a good set-up
  • ogwagonogwagon Wagonist
    You are correct about the A/C vent tubes on the drivers side. They would have to be removed on any underdash hydro conversion(including Sonem) because the master cylinder fits in the same space as the vents. I just capped of the heater box outlets going to the drivers side and removed the vent tubes. As long as the defroster and center vents work then I could live with it. I'll try to post some pics when I finally get around to putting this in.
  • turbo_tegturbo_teg Council Member
    yeah i was just wanting to do it without losing the tubes which i think if u did it just right it could work u might have to notch the smaller tube closer to the fire wall but i will most likely never do the swap i feel confident i have a solid set-up now.
  • MrM3MrM3 Council Member
    Sorry to bump an old thread but I was about to order this kit when Jaker warned me you were having trouble. So Ogwagon did you ever get yours in? Or is there updates on how to get this to work? Can you just bolt in a clutch pedal assembly from a EF and take care of the problem? I'm kinda out of my element on this and could use some suggestions or advice.
  • ogwagonogwagon Wagonist
    I did finally complete the install on my wagon. It works pretty good, although the clutch pedal still feels stiff. Keep in mind I am running an ACT heavy duty pressure plate. As stated before I ended up using the complete pedal assembly from a EX sedan because it already comes reinforced around the clutch pedal pivot area. I also added a few tabs to further reinforce the clutch pedal bracket and Sonem bracket because of the heavy pressure plate. I would also recommend adding some type of support to the left side of the bracket because it tends to pivot downward when pressing on the clutch pedal. I used a piece of 1/8 thick steel plate and braced it against the steering column support tube that surrounds the column. You will have to remove the a/c vent tubes that supply air to the left front door panel vent and the far left dashboard vent. I used a -4 steel braided hose, 66 inches long to connect the slave cylinder to the master cylinder(-4 worked better than -3). I used a -4 to 10mm banjo adapter(earl's # 997641) and 10x1.0mm banjo bolt(earl's # 997517) to connect the braided line to the master cylinder. Using these parts will help give you some needed clearance between the master cylinder and the sheet metal at the firewall. If not, you may have to either cut the sheet metal or take a sledge hammer to it. I took some pics during the install and will post some if you like as soon as I get a chance. Hope this info helps.
  • turbo_tegturbo_teg Council Member
    cool i just gave up since i coulnt get the master mounted without removing those AC vent tubes. post pics when u can.
  • MrM3MrM3 Council Member
    Thank you for the reply and I would appreciate pics if you get the chance. I wont have heat or a/c so I'm not worried about that vent. Guess I need to go hunt down a new pedal now.
  • EDwEFprtsEDwEFprts Senior Wagonist
    i would love to see some pics from ogwagonandturbo_teg!!!


    (edit: to post pictures you have to "host" them online (like photobucket.com). then in a reply you add image tags with your pic address between (like this: album ). photobucket actually gives you that info with the image tags. hope this can help.)
  • ogwagonogwagon Wagonist
    Sorry, I'm computer illiterate. I'm waiting for my friend to come over to help me post the pics. I will post these pics as soon as he comes over.
  • ogwagonogwagon Wagonist
    Sorry for the long wait. My buddy is over my house right now and is showing me how to post the pics. Anyway these are pics of the Sonem bracket and pedal assembly after I reinforced them and some show the whole thing assembled and installed in the car. Hope these pics help clear up what I was talking about.
    sonem1.jpg
    sonem2.jpg
    sonem3.jpg
    sonem4.jpg
    sonem5.jpg
    sonem6.jpg
    sonem7.jpg
    sonem8.jpg
  • JakerJaker familEE
    Thanks for the update and the pics. So what vents went bye-bye to clear this? Just the feed to the driver's dash and side window vents?

    I'm a bit concerned about the braided line going through the firewall. You might want to squeeze a rubber grommet into that hole.
  • ogwagonogwagon Wagonist
    Yeah, pretty much just those two vents need to be removed. I made these caps to seal off the heater case using the vent tubes I removed. I wrapped the braided line several times with fabric tape until I can find the right size grommet.ventcaps1.jpg
    ventcaps2.jpg
    ventcaps3.jpg
  • JakerJaker familEE
    But the vents in the dash for the defrost at the base of the windshield are still intact, right? I can still clear the windshield on a cold frosty morning :lol: :P :lol: ?
  • ogwagonogwagon Wagonist
    Yeah, the windshield defroster vents are still intact. I tried driving around with no heater case for a while in the name of weight savings. Biggest mistake ever! I ended up having to buy another one at the junkyard because I tossed out the old one. Oh well, live and learn.
  • JakerJaker familEE
    Thanks!
  • snm95lssnm95ls Band Wagon
    The wagon pedal assembly is different than other 4th gen Civics?

    Your solution looks good.

    8)
  • MrM3MrM3 Council Member
    snm95ls wrote:
    The wagon pedal assembly is different than other 4th gen Civics?

    Your solution looks good.

    8)
    ogwagon wrote:
    the wagon clutch pedal portion is very different from all the others. The clutch pedal pivot point on a wagon's pedal assembly sits about an inch and a half further back(closer to the firewall) than all other EF's. The Sonem bracket mounts to this pivot point, there lies the problem.
  • MrM3MrM3 Council Member
    Got all my stuff for this but haven't taken pics yet. I'll post in here when I get it installed.
  • turbo_tegturbo_teg Council Member
    I just cant bring myself to ditch some of my heater tubes..... iono i so wish i could do this my car needs it bad....
  • turbo_tegturbo_teg Council Member
    wonder if something like this can be stuffed up in there..... if the pedal was long enough and it could be mounted high enough so the master would clear the shock tower i think it could work.....

    wil-340-1290_w.jpg
  • Eagle BeagleEagle Beagle familEE
    I dont know what y'all talkin'
    about...

    fix'n it...
    ahh...

    nevermind...

    :mrgreen:
  • ogwagonogwagon Wagonist
    turbo_teg wrote:
    wonder if something like this can be stuffed up in there..... if the pedal was long enough and it could be mounted high enough so the master would clear the shock tower i think it could work.....
    Is that a reverse-swing mounted pedal? If so that still won't fit up there without removing the vent tubes. Before I installed the Sonem kit I tried a similar pedal configuration as the pic you posted. The one I tried was made by CNC brakes and actually took up more space than the Sonem kit. The problem is that in order to make a true hydraulic conversion for our cars, you have to utilize a reverse-swing clutch pedal configuration because EF/EE cars don't have the room to mount a clutch master cylinder on the firewall. The reverse-swing pedal assembly places the clutch master cylinder in the exact same place where the vent tubes are. If you try to lower the clutch pedal assembly to clear the vent tubes, you will not have sufficient clearance between the pedal and the floor board. If you try to shorten the pedal length, you will not have sufficient leverage from the short pedal to properly acuate the clutch without requiring heavy force.
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