DA knuckles w/big(ger) brake install

Instead of buying new pads/rotors which I needed; I opted to pick up some complete DA knuckles at the junkyard about 2 weeks back. The ones I chose had fresh pads (oem ;)) and spec'd rotors so I snagged the whole gig. I also pulled a 15/16 master cylinder from an older accord which has the EXACT same line up for brake lines (this instead of the teg' non-abs one since there are almost all tegs seem to be LS and GS); more on that install later though. I got both complete setups for $80 (with master cylinder) which is an absolute steal; I would say the pads have about 70% left on them which is totally fine with me. I cleaned everything up and repacked the ball joints and put on fresh(er) boots before the install.

Today is the DA knuckles/DA brake upgrade. Though they weigh a few more pounds than our brakes I definitely think the increased brake size will outweigh the added unsprung weight; plus I don't roll heavy ass wheels like most of you anyway (KISS with 14" DA GS-R wheels). I also installed my front Tokico HPs to complete my suspension setup (all DC componentry).

Both DA knucks
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RT4WD (left) vs. DA (right): I didn't measure specifically but I think the tegs were like 10.4" or so.
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The rotors are most definitely thicker and have larger venting.
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Piston is a tiny bit larger (sorry no direct pic), caliper is longer and wider too. teg left, civic right. Notice the length from the center of bearing to the center of the toe arm tab (teg longer).
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This is the only mod I had to do and I didn't even have to really. This is 1/2 ABS sensor tabs on the DA knuckle. When the suspension was totally drooping/unloaded and the knuckle was hanging the clearance between this tab and my spring was about 2mm. I didn't like that so I took off another 2mm from the tab. Stock suspension may be different.
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Here they are in all their glory.
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And this is why 14"+ wheels are required.
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Perfect brake line match from the DC to EE (that would also include EG and DA as well; all will work). I did NOT use the DA upper control arms as they are a tad longer (more + camber) and I liked my camber where it was prior to install. I will do an alignment on it manana to see where I am at. I haven't driven it yet as I forgot to buy brake fluid so I will finish the bleed/alignment tomorrow afternoon. I also opted NOT to install the master cylinder yet as I want to see how it feels with the stock unit first (7/8). The knuckles definitely through off the toe visibly and I am not sure about the caster/camber yet. I have no inclination that I cannot fix the alignment in 1 hour of my time tomorrow (yes I have the equip at home).

I love my car :D this thing is starting to turn into a Integra/Civic Hybrid. Hope this sparks some interest; very easy install.
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Comments

  • skinnyskinny Senior Wagonist
    Sweet post. Im looking into doing this mod too. what year did you put this on? Im rocking a 88.
  • Very nice info and pics man!!!
  • zer0sk8ordiezer0sk8ordie New Wagonist
    nice upgrade dude! do you recomend changing the brake booster also?
  • Thanks fellars.

    Skinny, as you will notice my sig shows my rides (year too!)

    Slammed, I'm all over those rack pics be on it soon ;)

    Brake booster? Not needed for this. If one was to install rear discs and maybe larger fronts than perhaps. I do not think the booster becomes an issue for a while, nor do I the prop valve with such a small increase. The master cylinder isn't even needed really; its more of a feel thing (will provide more positive feedback and won't be as "touchy", on/off with a proper MC).
  • noahrexion wrote:
    Slammed, I'm all over those rack pics be on it soon ;)
    Thanks mang!! 8)
  • zer0sk8ordiezer0sk8ordie New Wagonist
    oh ok yeah a buddy did this on his and a few weeks later his booster is goin out...
    thats why i ask, he also changed the prop. valve and master cyl.
    thanks
  • skinnyskinny Senior Wagonist
    I never change the prop valve. its such a bitch if the motor is in. never did it on the CRX and it had DA fronts, 93 SI rear disk. I could lock the wheels up no prob with the stock booster, master cyl, and prop valve. Oh and it was a HF :wink:
  • shenrieshenrie Council Member
    Youll want a EX sedan prop valve if you do any real hard braking. With the stock prop valve and da/dc knuckles youll have a little too much bias on the front wheels. I only notice it when under hard braking during autox though. I have never noticed it on the daily.

    Another thing is if you spend a lot of time driving really hard you might wanna think about putting the dust shields back on. Those not only keep dirt and stuff off the rotors, they help keep heat away from the axle joints. I removed mine right before a lapping day in Spokane and boiled over the left front axle from hard braking and the fucking boot popped and spewed grease all over my rotor going strong into a right hand corner. It about took me into the infield which is really not a good thing in Spokane, unless you enjoy trying to slide over lava rock at speed. Just a heads up if you ever take your car to a track. More than likley not an issue if you dont.
  • skinnyskinny Senior Wagonist
    I do plan on tracking my car so thats good advice. I was wondering why the shields were off. IMO I think there a must.



    What was the total cost of the whole set up? what parts did you go out and buy?
  • Noahrexion- Alignment being a must but what did it affect camber wise? I think I can pick a set of these up on the cheap at a local parts yard but its the secondary work thats seems like it might drain the wallet i.e. alignments, camber kits, rotors/pads. Wondering if its bolt and go...
  • cool presentation with detailed pics.


    wagon........ever..................
  • skinnyskinny Senior Wagonist
    Well if the rotors are good you could use the pads that are in them and burn the rust of with a few hard stops. then slap new pads in. it looks like he either had the rotors re surfaced or got new ones all togeter. Camber is going to be off with the larger hubs. If you ave coil overs you can make up for it alittle. If your like me and dont care I think it would be in the 150-200 range over all. It really depends on how much you get ball joint to ball joint for. I have been quoted at pick a part for 100 for both sides i pull 150 they pull. Figure anywhere from 12-60 for pads depending how cheap/good you wanna go. Only advice I can give is make sure the ball joint and wheel bearing is good. Wen I had my crx we did the hard stop and pad switch instead of new rotors. after about 5-8 stops they looked brand new, atleast the contact surface did :lol:
  • The dust/splash shields do very very little in the form of melting the axle boots when removed I am not worried about that at all. I was actually planning on making a small scoop for the brakes too (not unlike my Miata;s factory airdam does). This is something I have done on a number of my vehicles and I have never once had an issue.

    Although all this was not initially the reason I removed them. They were heavily damaged and quite unsightly.

    I would absolutely recommend to anyone doing this to really check out the wheel bearing (most expensive replacement if something in the hub needed replaced) and of course the ball joints/no slight bends or cracks and GOOD brakes. Again, this was not my intention to buy these things, it just turned out a better financial deal to me. When I bought my car the one thing I didn't do was buy brakes for it (long project otherwise); I had planned on new pads/rotors for about 4-5 months now. Finally, after mountain driving/towing and generally using the thing, I got to the point where I was ready to buy some. I was at the junkyard and saw a really really clean/well taken care of DA that had (to me) had the suspension damaged in any way nor the axles removed in quite some time; if ever. The ball joints looked (hard to tell fully until you get them home) good and most importantly, the brake rotors and pads were OEM and they pads had 70-80% life in them: that sold me. I bought all this, a 15/16 Accord brake MC and some other misc junk for $83 at a Denver pull a part yard. I spent a couple hours cleaning and going through, relubing, respraying, scrubbing...etc and making them look how they do. Everything was reused. I didn't buy ANY additional parts at all. I made the calipers look new (they were in great shape to being with) and I gave my own sanding to the rotors/pads.

    So far I haven't put the 15/16 BMC in yet as I want to see if I even care (don't think I will as of this point). The ~1" increase and larger pad are a mere side effect; the way I see it is I got myself my new front brakes for $83 or so.

    Also someone asked about the alignment: my camber was changed no more than .2* on either side; that could have happened if I removed the stock one and reinstalled it: so no, camber was not an issue for my car. I did a really quick alignment check the other day and set my toe back to zero. The blurb in one of the pics above about the tie rod end arm on the DA knuckle extends out differently than the civic. This through my tow out about 3/16" on both sides. These are all done via my home measurements with my SPC setup and I've been doing alignments for years.
  • skinnyskinny Senior Wagonist
    Thats gangster yo :!:
  • oilspotoilspot Wagonist
    I just took my wagon on a drive after having it in my shop for almost a year.
    In that time I put DA spindles, rotors, calipers, master cylinder, and brake booster.
    Very nice brakes!!! I was kinda afraid that they may be kinda touchy; not at all. They're super smooth but if you really get into the pedal they bring you to a stop quick!

    Highly recomend the upgrade.

    I used the 1" abs booster and master cylinder. All the info i had found said that i would have to replace the fitting on the brake line furthur back (on the master cylinder). I was able to order a small adapter piece from a local hydraulics store.
  • BrakeExpertBrakeExpert New Wagonist
    With DAs, and I don't know if its all, but most i've seen have the rear hardline port (of the two) that is bigger and requires a 12mm brake line wrench, where every other 90s Honda uses the 10mm fittings on both hardline ports on like all of em.
  • oilspotoilspot Wagonist
    With DAs, and I don't know if its all, but most i've seen have the rear hardline port (of the two) that is bigger and requires a 12mm brake line wrench, where every other 90s Honda uses the 10mm fittings on both hardline ports on like all of em.
    From what i read the bigger fitting on the master cylinders is just in the abs model master cylinders. The 1" ones.
  • jpciiijpciii familEE
    noahrexion,

    Are you able to post your caster and camber measurements? Thanks!
  • wagotailwagotail Band Wagon
    i did this mod (well you have to go if you go b series). but the master cylinder was a no go. My da6 doner car had abs. the master cylinder had brake line ports on opposite locations. wouldn't go in. Then i tried a DC (94-01) master cylinder, that was no go too cause it mounted differently. Any ideas?
  • bam-bambam-bam Council Member
    The 15/16 master cylinder from a '90-'91 EX sedan is a direct fit.
  • klumklum Senior Wagonist
    so there was no repercussion from using a DA knuckle in terms of allignment?
    i have a lifetime allignment on my car so getting it retuned wouldnt be a issue if its a reasonable change..
    Im looking to do this instead of replacing my wheel bearing and ball joint on my currrent setup
    also im not to thrilled with my current ghetto itr brake setup either
  • klumklum Senior Wagonist
    any one?????????????
  • The toe will be WAY off, as far as camber I can't tell much difference. The toe is really bad on mine. If I'm looking at the wheel and have the lip lined up i'm standing about a foot out from down the side of my car.

    If it gets a bit warmer i'll try and put my new tie rod ends on (the bolts on mine were messed up) and get it close..

    But yes you will need an alignment if you do the DA brake swap. I just hope you live close to where you get your alignments done, i drove about 70 miles overall yesterday trying to get my car aligned and.. Well, it was a feeling of being near death all the time.
  • klumklum Senior Wagonist
    im lucky enough to have a shop that does allignments , i have a lifetime allignment deal on my car actually so all you need is to replace the knuckle or do you need the whole assymbley?
  • TheGmanTheGman Wagonist
    klum wrote:
    im lucky enough to have a shop that does allignments , i have a lifetime allignment deal on my car actually so all you need is to replace the knuckle or do you need the whole assymbley?

    yessir! Just whats pictured in the OP's first post.

    Also be really careful when driving with the toe as far out as its going to be. Seriously my car was all over the road.
  • klumklum Senior Wagonist
    but its correctable with an allignment though right!?! lol
  • TheGmanTheGman Wagonist
    klum wrote:
    but its correctable with an allignment though right!?! lol


    It is correctable yes.
  • klumklum Senior Wagonist
    do we need to use the camber arm? or can we use an adjustable one? and if so what civic has a interchangable upper control arm
    sorry for the hassle!
  • TheGmanTheGman Wagonist
    The spindle will bolt to the stock civic upper arm, so theoretically an adjustable camber arm designed for a civic would work. :)

    I got back from les schwabs and they gave me the readout on what my specs were/are. (granted this is after i had put my teg spindles on) But i'm running 5.1 degrees of camber up front and 5.6 in back, toe was set to 0 in front, and about .08 or something like that in back.

    I drove around for maybe 120 miles with the toe anywhere between 3 and 1.4 degrees, which was scary. and probably severely decreased the amount of miles i'll be able to drive on those tires but whatever.
  • 503Wagon503Wagon moderator
    if someone were to do this...would they be able to get back into factory specs for the alignment? cuz i know damn well most of us are not going to drive around on 5 degrees of camber...thats how you eat tires.
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