the 170hp sohc build
lucskywalker
Wagonist
ok here it goes, by far the best hp #s came from 88-91 d15 block, yes it sounds strange but its true the only downfall if you will is 3fp less tork, so dx makes the best power from the piston, its a flat top with real nice deep cut valve relief very nice if you use d16y8 head, this head has a small chamber pentroof design, this build is close to the gsr motor. this creates quench which forces all the volume to the spark plug. this type of motor acually does not like advance at all but resists detination nicely. in all the sohc builds all the head parts that i will list make around the same hp. hear is a list to make a sohc vtec scream.
head: d16z6,d16y8,d15b(jdm vtec),d15b-obd2(also jdm vtec-3stage)
block: any sohc d series except d17 and 86-87 d15
88-91 dx has the perfect piston shape, 88-91 hf has dome for high compression (but note do not use any aftermarket cam!!! you will bend every valve on the intake side) if you find a 88 & up dohc zc pistons this is good for the z6 head (close to obd0 b16 motor) but please dont take apart a perfectly good dohc zc to get these those motor are now pretty rare and im very fond of it
then you have sohc z6zc piston its the same dome, again note you shouldnt use y8 head combo for a daily driver comp, is to high!!! 86-89 teg pistons has a goofy round dome and almost no relief for the valves and is a no go for the y8 head as it will hit the head and as for any cams for these pistons they will bend valves, so long story short pistons of choice are dx,si,ex,vx,hx if you want 170hp and stock piston you will have to use a cam, zex cam, comp cam, skunk cam, ect...
rods 86-87 teg d16a1 have very stong rods!! 88-89 are wimpy just like the sohc so dont mistake them also note the only d15 these will work in is the jdm d15b vtec also note no d15 and 96-00 d16 block has the 3 bolt revisions for inter/shaft so all you awd guys buy wisely
but a plus for the 96-00 blocks is it has a hole for the knock sensor needed to run b16 pr3/pwo ecu, like i said before there is so many combos you can run and i have most likely left some stuff out so if you have any questions post them! 
ok now for the head, this is where 90% of the power comes from
skunk manifold
skunk or equivalant springs/retainers
zex cam, is a sweet cam, but so is the many to choose from cams from comp cams, and skunk cam is great also but they are always on back order.
throttle body any b-series will work ive found the gsr to work the best but you will have to change how the cable pulls the butterfly, b16s are easy to find and ls is the easyest to find but smaller, never the less they are all way bigger than d-series you can acually fit d's into the b's
skunk cam gear has worked the best for me never had it slip or strip like some other name brands that i will fail to mention,
skunk valves, cause they have a optional high compression set to choose from
now the port and polish, you can do it yourself it easy but time consuming otherwise expect to pay 5-800 bucks!! you need a dremel tool and the big dremel bit set. porting does not mean hogging it out as big as you can, the only heads i port bigger is the d16y8 only because one valve hole on each intake runner is smaller then the other and i only make the 2 holes around the same size, really you want to start out by taking out the casting flash lines, then work the valve seats into the runners smoothly as possible. then smooth out all the ruffness of all the runner, do not polish the intake side!! slight ruffnes is good for mixing the fuel just hone the surface smooth like say to a 120 grit finish. now do the same for the hot side, but this time polish it like a mirror you will want to get some 600,800,1000,1500,2000 grit flat sandpaper and work it with your fingers, then finish it of with some neverdull polish. be very carefull of the valve seat where the valve closes if you scratch/gouge them you motor will put-put and you'll be taking it to the machine shop to have the seats cut but if you head has alot of wear you'll want to do this anyway.
then for a extra mile bonus polish the combustion chamber this also aid in keeping carbon from building up, plus just think back when you where a kid, was the slide of choice the old rusty one or the brand new shiny one? air and burned fuel feel the shiny one as well
ecu yes you can go obd1 and p28 but that ecu was for 128hp, this is why i have always loved honda motors so many choices, your newly built d-series with all i have mentioned now has the airflow of the b16 as long as you have the aftermarket cams! so now you have a oem upgrade ecu there are many obd0 b16 ecu to come by use them they will put a smile on your face!!
everything else can stay obd0 injectors distributor
as i said before there is to much to write in one post so any questions by all means ask, all this sound pricey but it comes like 3-500 bucks cheaper than the b16 swap and the 100 pound diffrence makes this build always makes the same car loose to the d-series they sold to you cause it wasnt fast enough!!!!!
head: d16z6,d16y8,d15b(jdm vtec),d15b-obd2(also jdm vtec-3stage)
block: any sohc d series except d17 and 86-87 d15
88-91 dx has the perfect piston shape, 88-91 hf has dome for high compression (but note do not use any aftermarket cam!!! you will bend every valve on the intake side) if you find a 88 & up dohc zc pistons this is good for the z6 head (close to obd0 b16 motor) but please dont take apart a perfectly good dohc zc to get these those motor are now pretty rare and im very fond of it
then you have sohc z6zc piston its the same dome, again note you shouldnt use y8 head combo for a daily driver comp, is to high!!! 86-89 teg pistons has a goofy round dome and almost no relief for the valves and is a no go for the y8 head as it will hit the head and as for any cams for these pistons they will bend valves, so long story short pistons of choice are dx,si,ex,vx,hx if you want 170hp and stock piston you will have to use a cam, zex cam, comp cam, skunk cam, ect...rods 86-87 teg d16a1 have very stong rods!! 88-89 are wimpy just like the sohc so dont mistake them also note the only d15 these will work in is the jdm d15b vtec also note no d15 and 96-00 d16 block has the 3 bolt revisions for inter/shaft so all you awd guys buy wisely
but a plus for the 96-00 blocks is it has a hole for the knock sensor needed to run b16 pr3/pwo ecu, like i said before there is so many combos you can run and i have most likely left some stuff out so if you have any questions post them! ok now for the head, this is where 90% of the power comes from
skunk manifold
skunk or equivalant springs/retainers
zex cam, is a sweet cam, but so is the many to choose from cams from comp cams, and skunk cam is great also but they are always on back order.
throttle body any b-series will work ive found the gsr to work the best but you will have to change how the cable pulls the butterfly, b16s are easy to find and ls is the easyest to find but smaller, never the less they are all way bigger than d-series you can acually fit d's into the b's
skunk cam gear has worked the best for me never had it slip or strip like some other name brands that i will fail to mention,
skunk valves, cause they have a optional high compression set to choose from
now the port and polish, you can do it yourself it easy but time consuming otherwise expect to pay 5-800 bucks!! you need a dremel tool and the big dremel bit set. porting does not mean hogging it out as big as you can, the only heads i port bigger is the d16y8 only because one valve hole on each intake runner is smaller then the other and i only make the 2 holes around the same size, really you want to start out by taking out the casting flash lines, then work the valve seats into the runners smoothly as possible. then smooth out all the ruffness of all the runner, do not polish the intake side!! slight ruffnes is good for mixing the fuel just hone the surface smooth like say to a 120 grit finish. now do the same for the hot side, but this time polish it like a mirror you will want to get some 600,800,1000,1500,2000 grit flat sandpaper and work it with your fingers, then finish it of with some neverdull polish. be very carefull of the valve seat where the valve closes if you scratch/gouge them you motor will put-put and you'll be taking it to the machine shop to have the seats cut but if you head has alot of wear you'll want to do this anyway.
then for a extra mile bonus polish the combustion chamber this also aid in keeping carbon from building up, plus just think back when you where a kid, was the slide of choice the old rusty one or the brand new shiny one? air and burned fuel feel the shiny one as well
ecu yes you can go obd1 and p28 but that ecu was for 128hp, this is why i have always loved honda motors so many choices, your newly built d-series with all i have mentioned now has the airflow of the b16 as long as you have the aftermarket cams! so now you have a oem upgrade ecu
there are many obd0 b16 ecu to come by use them they will put a smile on your face!!everything else can stay obd0 injectors distributor
as i said before there is to much to write in one post so any questions by all means ask, all this sound pricey but it comes like 3-500 bucks cheaper than the b16 swap and the 100 pound diffrence makes this build always makes the same car loose to the d-series they sold to you cause it wasnt fast enough!!!!!
This discussion has been closed.
Comments
DOHC ZC block with internals
DOHC ZC head
The A6 in my RT4WD right now
The ZC is just block, head and internals, no manifolds.
I'm thinking A6 block with ZC rods/pistons, Z6 head, B16 TB(obd0 right?) PW0 ECU?!?!?! :?
well explained
should it be stickied?
yes the zc is next,ill do a whole breakdown, this motor is my fav, it was the type r of its day!!
Undoubtedly you're talking about a nicely massaged D series, but 170hp is a somewhat magical number unless your name is Bisi and you run carbs or Kinslers.
I'm a huge fan of the D - my D16A6 build outran LS engines all day and ran dead even with my wife's B16A2 hatch, but I also realize their limitations. I think if building a 170hp D were this easy then we'd see many, many more of them than we do swaps. unfortunately too many people build D engines half-cocked and get it wrong, and thus say "SOHC sucks I'm going B series!" and after that the rest is history.
Do you have some dyno charts of one of these set-ups?
Also have you guys ever browsed any of the old D series forums? If Mista Bone happens upon this topic I'm sure he could chime in about how there have been some epic D N/A builds on D series.org.
And does anyone have any opinions with my first post on what I should do to build a good A6/Z6 setup???
i believe in one seventy ... never hoped to kick it all day ...
sure, it will not be easy ...
but to think of it, aint it a beauty, taking most of the
construction, called wagon, to the limits of it ...
pitty there is a weak spot ... the 4wd ...
: ) yeah, wait and keep coming back & keep reading over and over ...
and then start building ...
grrr, owh ... bark bark
...
: )
With ZC dome topped +7.2cc domed pistons and a Z6 head on an A6 block the CR would be pretty damned high! I'm getting like 12.8:1 when I punch in the numbers on THIS D SERIES CR CALCULATOR (clickable)
You're better off with 86-87 flat top Integra D16A1 pistons with their +1.3cc domes, or even stock A6 pistons and their slight dish.
Plug different numbers in on that calculator to get a rough idea - it's pretty fun! Try a Y8 head, P29 pistons, etc.
hello "evol911" , so you have a dohc zc already built? if so how built, rods,pistons everything? if you have dohc use it this motor has a great power band, a real nice intake manifold, and is only 15 lbs more than sohc. port and polish the head these runners are way bigger than sohc and this motor can flow real good cfm's. kinda wonder how honda made the sohc vtec make nearly the same power stock!!! but in the long run dohc zc will make more power. as far as TB goes b-series doesnt bolt to that mani, u can get the skunk mani for sohc and make the adaptor plate or find it, i keep reading about some company makes it but cant seem to find info on where to buy one. ive made my own before one out of aluminum, and 1 out of pvc board (aka..starbrite,and celtic board) i thought of this stuff when i saw that heat spacer that hondata and others made, i just changed the purpose a little and gave it two jobs.
the rest is fab, i never got to dyno tune but the butdyne felt like it was equil to 7psi boost, and didnt have to spool. my turbo zc i did dyno and was 210 hp to the wheel wich is quite humerous concidering i took all the parts from a 97 gsx eclipse also rated 210hp but at the crank! strange.....
so if you have low comp i just talked about how fun turbo zc is its also cheap paid 350 bucks to make that happen. yes junkyards are the best!
and yes folks na sohc with the same ITB setup will put down 170whp with only apexi neo for tune if you must use the old vafc as well, i would prefer aem ems but that puts the build a little more than the b16 swap but nothing is better than stand alone!!! you can even do megasquirt2 it goes for a mere $100 build it yourself otherwise expect to pay $250 already built.
we are in the prosses of building the dyno at the shop i work at so i can send some charts of my wagon build, this one is a lower comp. build mainly for my turbo but while i still have my cam in it i will dyno na first i expect 158ish
must go now work is later today, i write more when i can, sleep now
Later
But I do have it for some parts and I'm picking up a Z6 head for cheap cheap and just wondering what my options are. I'm not one for v-tec really, I would rather massage a ZC but I'm definetly not going to pay $700 for one (Lowest price I could find on the West Coast).
Yo B18C5, come on man whats wrong with almost 13:1 CR
so yes use those parts, again you didnt mention the internal changes ie forged/compression but no matter they can be used as long as they are in good shape, as for the z6 head like i said port/polish and valve train comp cams is my real choice for there selection, ill have to dig up the numbers but they have a cam with the same lift /duration as the b16 and a few bigger sets that will take out the comfort in a daily driver. just do yourself a favor and replace the valve seals, it sucks to put all the work in to have a fast smokey motor
b16 stuff: TB, injectors, ecu-pr3/pwo is just plug and play with the additional pinning of vtec/knock sensor/extra o2, KSmust be grounded to the block and vibration free, b-series TB will bolt to any 92up intake manifold if you use obd1 injectors you must eliminate the resistor box. and for the distributor any sohc obd0 that is mpfi will work, just have to drill the holes for line up, y8 bolts right to obd0 dizzy
There are lots of little things that seem to make these builds not completely thought out but rather a collection of "good" parts. The problem being that engines don't give a shit about "good" parts, only ones that work well with that particular motor. Read up on some stuff at onecamonly.com (that's where the knowledgeable people seem to gather).
And no, I haven't any work to show for my theorys (I'm starting on the head for my motor, though, so I should have some evidence soon).
well-well, seem i have a disgruntaled fan
also seems that your opinion was just thrown together like my motor/motors for years now have been.
and yes all this info was thrown together, as i dont really have the time to be telling people my wisdom. i work 10-12 hours a day 6 days a week!
but i still thought some people would like to know what i know.
if anyone want to know out dated sohc just ask, oh, thats why i wrote all this stuff. i will always say i dont know everything about hondas cause there is someone out there who knows more than i, but i can say that i have forgotten more about hondas than most people THINK they know about them. back in 93 i bought my first car, 88 civic 4d dx i saw the quality in them, so much that still in 08 i have never bought another brand since.
now to fix some of these statments, the funniest thing i think you said is about the valves, ok here is what you do. go out find your self a 200000mile motor one that doesnt smoke so you know the cyls are sealed. get your compression tester out and do a test. now take the head off and clean the carbon off everything put it back together you will find a diffrence in your test. wow look at that its lower wow physics is a b$%#@.
and no the valves are still the same weight because ive never seen a high comp, valve that did not have a taperd stem for better airflow. and it might sound funny that i would use these valves on a turbo build, but i like the flat top valve for air flow reasons. if you were air do you want to go in a dish come back out then leave the room, or would you like to slide by and not make any turbulance?
now the TB's and manifolds. every part i have mentioned are dyno proven parts from big names, and if you think Dr.C Madrid and the skunk gang are out wasting their time, why are they still around after all these years? and if you paid attention to the TB' i named i did not say the b18c typeR TB is the biggest you want the biggest you can get! and how many manifolds have you seen? skunk is by far the most modest nothing insanely oversized just smoother and more direct.
ITB's mine were real quiet actually, mostly cause i made a fiber glass filter box for it. i used to live south florida, as much as i injoy building motors, i do not like distroying them by sucking as much sandy air down their gully. plus im not made of money! and they are fast! side drafts and ITB's have been part of auto history for decades, if they wernt all that why would BMW use them, huh even my bosses r34 skyline has them factory issued!
so what do you know really besides you can surf the net for info
i dont want to fight at all, butt dont you think you could have asked your opinion on the valves? and maybie you could have said that a bigger TB is only gonna make the motor think that its open more than it really is and only perform the same? then you would have some friendly truth if we were talking about a stock motor
Do you have a scanner?
Anyways like I said before - if building a 170hp SOHC was EASY then everyone would do it. The stuff you're posting as info isn't something that 1/4 of the members of this MB can do themselves, or have access to do.
For a lot of people buying a swap that remains 100% bone stock but is much faster than his old D is much quicker and easier than building a monster SOHC that will never be as reliable as a stock Honda engine.
Also what transmission would you bolt this engine to?
yes your right, the b-series is drop in fun, ive had to many to remember, but like i said ive done this a long time. i did my first dpfi convertion in 95, just because the motors look the same it got me intrested in what was diffrent.
i cant remember what mag honda tuning or superstreet did this write up years ago now but was so happy they did it. was nice the see the big media notice that there was power in this motor.
in the trend of doing b-series and my opinion bad idea h22 swaps, i went a diffrent way after a while maybie i was just bored there was nothing saying hay look no individuality. i always get flack for my ideas, then they see how it works out they praise but still wouldnt do it cause its not popular. ive built some weird stuff like b16 with ls head got a lot of crap for that one but i love that motor.
sorry i dont know where my disks are with the dyno charts are since ive moved from florida i cant find a lot of things, but i said before new ones are coming soon, i never said you will have this power if you thow all this stuff together its more than just parts, there is so much ive yet to have time to post. but what i did say is you can smoke many a b for less cash. and it really doesnt take access to do this stuff huh ive done some of these motors in a spare bedroom. the trans i had used was my zc si fdrive i also had 13" steelies i always run those on the dyno for safety issues. and i know everyone has bolted some 13s back on to find i think i just put 5hp on my ride. i love that trans as well but i had to have someone else do it and i dont like that cause of special machining to fit the fd i just cant do it
I'm trying to build an Z6/A6(ZC slugs and rods) using all OEM parts save for cam/valves/springs/retainers. Everything else wil be stock and hopefully reliable since everyone keeps talking like the motors blow up within the first 30 minutes of starting. Why does reliability take such a big hit when doing these swaps? Wouldn't it be the same as replacing a stock head? Yes, I know tuning is required when CR gets up there but a good tune is what keeps these motors reliable!!
you dont want any part way from factory limits(ations)
never heard an engine blown by just idle-ing for half an hour ...
stock said, alone is not like from heaven sent ...
trust me, and my stock car
: )
Thanks for all the info man, it's been helpful hahaha i know the guy to come to when i have questions on if i build or turbo my D-series engine!
I guess you missed where I posted the compression calculator for the D series, or suggested 86-87 Integra flat top pistons or even sticking with PM6 pistons?
Problem is that once you build an engine involving any machine shop/work, and aftermarket pistons I will take the belief to my grave that it will never be as reliable as OE Honda parts, and even still I still contend that a Honda-built engine will outlast a "person" built engine.
You have to trust that the machine shop doesn't screw the head or cylinder bores up, that the parts you buy aren't shit parts, etc.
The engine I built like 5 years ago is still running 100% perfect. I used all genhine Honda/Acura parts and was painstaking when I built it.
Here rather than me tell you I'll show you a few pics.
How about not tossing in all green bearings or "standard" ACL bearings? I read the codes and put the proper bearings in as Honda does:
And the P29 pistons:
...and the all genuine parts:
Now I'm not trying to start anything with the OP, and I'm not some doubting Thomas on SOHCs since I love them.
I am just not going to take anything someone says when it comes to an engine making xxxwhp. I'm not going to tell you my 11:1CR D16A6 makes 140whp just because it outran every LS swap I ran it against and ran even with a 143whp B16A swap my wife had. I never dynoed it nor tuned it because it was my DD and I didn't care. I'd have tuned it if it spark knocked, or ran funny, but it ran perfect so I didn't care.
To be honest even with the CR bump on stock cam and head I think it was maybe in the 120whp range. I'm being realistic.
I'm a "SHOW ME" guy, not a "post up a theoritcal build and tell me it will make 170hp with no dyno" type of guy. Again I'm not trying to be an ass.
Well, to reply. I understand what you're saying about a flat face valve flowing better but I really can't see that influencing the intake valve. I understood this point previously and failed to bring it up. Also, I wasn't comparing an aftermarket valve to an oem valve for weight. I was comparing aftermarket dished face to an aftermarket flat faced valve. More metal (the flat face) is heavier. I'd also like to point out that the flow difference on a flat face valve may negate the weight difference. It is probably impossible to know, but I was just posting my concerns. I honestly don't really believe the average D build needs money put into valves. There's other places to gain 2hp that are more often overlooked.
Also, the tb is a valid concern. I know a couple of wheel to wheel racers who have dynod losses on anything other than 55-56mm tb's. Bigger is not always better......
I was not saying that itbs don't work. I was saying that taking a couple bike itbs and bolting them onto a car is not going to guarantee power. Bmw and Nissan have more intelligent people than you or me designing that shit.
And yes, I think that some aftermarket companies are wasting their time. They don't give a shit because they make a killing. This is not a rule of thumb, but just because one spends money on a build does not mean it performs.
I'd be interested in seeing dynos of some of your motors. There's so much theory and so many different approaches that seem to work on at least some level.
evol911. I am trying to add. I'm saying research this stuff for yourself. Find a mentor who loves shooting the shit about motors (I just did for an hour earlier tonight). Discussion does nothing but improve if it can be held in an intelligent manner.
it also seems that with my over 10 years of experiance i have been trying to be that mentor, i mean geez im talking 50 horses give or take! honda has been doing this a long time, to be more clear b18c motor j-spec is 210 hp thats 40 over the same block its based on could have been more but a production motor must be reliable so i guess im just a fool. not like really care that much. the facts i have stated are d-series are cheap to find and build and since mugen stop making parts for the d years ago, everyone will just have to settle for the companys wasting there time rolling in dough with there 30hp cams
ive never had reliable issues with my setups if fact ive tried to kill a few d's in my day and it just didnt happen!! btw yes b18c5-eh guy your right about the honda only parts, thats all i ever use i went the other way one time and payed big time!
to end my chat this evening do you guys not concider things like sea level, air temp, humidity, oil viscosity, balancing,octane, running electric water pumps, not useing antifreez but useing anti corossive additive instead,ect... dudes its 50 extra hp!! get over it.
peace out
curiosity killed the cat...eh...thread...
: )
What I'm trying to do is build this motor using all OEM parts and I have never done this before so I'm trying to get all the input I can.
Walk with me a bit and let me tell you guys my idea:
First the only machining I really want to do is the head, make sure its nice and flat and get the seals and seats done. My plan was to drop my A6 out, remove the A6 pistons/rods, install the PM7 rods/pistons with new bearings and rings, replace seals/gaskets/ water pump and such using OEM Honda, install Z6 head, Y8 manifold and keep the car OBD0(injectors/distr.). Maybe try one of those PS9 one wire VTEC ECU's form Xenocron with a good basemap and then hit a dyno to get it tuned properly. I'm not looking for a powerhouse, just something to make me giggle like a schoolgirl when I step on the gas. So give me some input, I'm really trying to work with what I have.
Hey eldonciv777, I was kind of hoping thats what this thread would be. I have researched but there is so much bullshit that I can never get a straight answer or moreover a straight path on whats good or whats not. It seems as though you, B18C5-EH2, and lucskywalker have more seat time with these build than I do. If this thread keeps going likes its going its gonna turn into a H-T thread and everyones gonna start posting one word replies --> "Teh N00B" and then start telling mom jokes.
And thanks for the CR calculator B18C5-EH2, I actually stumbled on that a couple of days ago but thanks anyways.
I know this doesn't matter much but you have to change the deck height from .02 to .0254. I came up with 12.5:1.
And this brings me another question... Is 12.5:1 do-able for street use???
I personally would never run 12.5:1CR on a daily driven engine, especially with cast pistons.
As far as the general topic goes I'll make this my last reply so that it doesn't get to "H-T" for everyone.
I think it's great that lucskywalker joined the board and is sharing information. The thing is nothing he has posted is revolutionary information that cannot be found on D-series, H-T (believe it or not there is an archived topic for the SOHC with a lot of excellent engine theory, actual builds with hard numbers, etc.), etc. etc. He isn't reinventing the wheel here, and anyone with a general knowledge of these cars can come in and say "take this block, this head, now port the head, and then tune it, etc."
I don't know why a general engine theory topic is stickied as if it's all new, 100% correct information with factual dyno charts, etc. to back it up.
I don't want to sound like the anti-lucskywalker but even some of the info he posted can be refuted by many people with flow bench results, dyno charts, etc. especially when it comes to his suggestion to use a D16Y8 head of all heads he could have chosen.
The D16Y8 head does NOT flow as well as the D16Z6 when flowed on a flow bench. The Y8 was built more as an economy motor with the squared chambers and quench area, so compromises in flow are the consequence. I thought it was common enough knowledge among D series engine builders that the Y8 head was the last head (aside from the Y7, etc.) to build upon. Many people will even argue that a VTEC head is a waste and that you can do much more with portwork and a much larger cam on a D16A6 head since Honda basically didn't do much for emissions in those heads. You can run a larger cam in an A6 head too.
Ask Bisi (you know the SOHC god who ran 10's with a 1.5L SOHC, and now 9's with a 2.2 SOHC) and he will also tell you that he prefers the non-VTEC heads because he can get more power more easily from them. I've talked to him via H-T PM years ago - now he is someone who actually had a 170ish D16A6 street CR-X back in the day, and his word is the final word as far as many are concerned.
Like I said if you really want to talk to D series Gods head over to the D series forum and see some actual dyno charts, flow bench results, etc. etc.
Evol if you want a build topic by all means post one up dedicated to your own engine build, etc. and I'll be happy to help. I do not know everything, but I'm also not saying that I do and that my experience trumps all comers.
BTW since I'm not checking back in I did want to directly reply to lucskywalker who is anyone tossed out a somewhat childish remark when he posted:
I have never been spanked by an N/A D series build in any capacity with my B18C5 swap. also you might think "well this guy spent $5,000.00+ for his swap, etc." but I purchased a legit ITR (the entire car) back in 2001 for only $4,000.00 and after I sold off the 5 lug, dash, interior, etc. I ended up with a $1,800.00 or so B18C5 swap that has made a 100% OE reliable 178whp/132ft-lbs. of torque to the wheels for 7 years and counting. Combine the 8500rpm and shorter than any D series transmission ever you can understand the uphill climb even a 170whp D would have, right?
...but this isn't supposed to be about B vs. D is it? I only tossed the B series into the equation because you first compared it to the B16A in your own initial post, and then toss out insults to anyone differing in opinion or even agreeing somewhat but asking for actual PROOF.
Have fun guys! Don't believe everything you read online though! If you build this "170hp" D and end up with 130whp on the dyno don't ask why.
By the way I NEVER said a 170hp D series wasn't possible - I'm just saying that unless we see a dyno I can't say this guy here has built one. Bisi is a god amongst men when it comes to the SOHC Honda engines. I'd hardly call his builds "typical" or even repeatable unless he does the headwork, tuning, etc.
y8 cumbustion chamber flows well its not that its the intake runners, they are staggerd to create swirl and it doesnt make less power it just shifts the powerband lower in the rpms, hence the reason for me to port the intake side as i have posted earlyer.
also there is a slim to none chance that people can buy a b18c5 back in 01' for the price you have thats a great find! even today these cars are almost 10 years old its hard to do.
for a budget minded guy he can build a d, for less green.
in na form its true this motor will never be the (powerhouse) but as you finally admitted you CAN make 170ish hp
as for my build in my wagon economy sucks right now, i have everyones leftover junk that has been more fortunate to be able to buy the mighty B
in these times,
and the parts i have chosen were primarily for a mild turbo motor and in mild form i say go reserch it anywere 7-8psi and good tune = 178hp and 168ft trust me you cant swap in any honda motor with those torqe # and these turbo d's are dependable just dont get greedy and turn up the boost!!
in my theorys its not just the hp that D win a race it the weight also, and if you follow what honda does you will see thats what they think as well.
D,B,F,H, these are all the past cause theres a K now thats weighs less than the B sits further back in the bay and dynos 199hp to the wheels with almost noting done to it! and funny to me with the slinder shape of the valve cover honda must have liked the way the D looked!
please no more argue just post what you know you have spent many posts calling me out just to say that someone has made that 170ish hp motor!
if i wanna have short-fun i run nitro, stock !
strap a rocket to my roof an go, stock !
why do i always have to say sumt'n stupid ..
owh...i dont have to
: )
Here's a good thread on HT with some dynos and whatnot.
http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=2244465
I hopefully will have some dynos of my motor done by april of next year. Hoping to hit 150+hp.
BTW, one of the guys who is helping me with things has a high compression d15 running stock everything except for the fact that it has p29's and a cut down block iirc. He has a custom header, exhaust, and custom cai on the car but is still running dpfi with a stock ecu due to the classes that he races in. It puts down 110hp and 90ft lbs of torque. The torque curve is virtually flat from 3-6.5k. He's going to try to get a couple more hp out of it this winter with some other legal things. And for reference, a friend who races with him only gets 112 out of his d16a6 with similiar mods, and the top guy on the east coast only gets around 125 out of his a6. Considering this, I'd say his d15 is doing pretty good.
EDIT: As for the compression. A tuner on ht just tuned a 12.5:1 y8 on a stock cam on 87 octane. It put down upper 130's iirc. I believe the tuner was joseph davis and he made a thread about it in the n/a section on ht. I'd look it up but I don't have the time.