was going to take on the 1995 GSR integra
949
Senior Wagonist
i almost got a supercharger for my rt4wd wagon to take on my friends gsr integra. dang it. but the guy who was selling wasnt dropping the price to where i wanted to pay for it. would have been interesting to see what it would have been like to run.
Comments
Its true that superchargers rob you of some power (depending on your method), but you need to take into account that generally no one ever tries to cool the air-flow... As soon as you add a cooling effect (i.e. air-water intercooler) theres that 20-30% made back.
Its really personal preference again - do you want low down torque, do you want high up power, do you want a resonsive engine, do you want a mix etc. etc..
I'm going supercharger w/ air-water intercooler... every man in his dog is going turbo and i just wanna be different (hell, i bought a shuttle!)...
Not trying to be an asshole, but being belt driven takes power from the motor no mater how you intercool. Same as disconnecting your AC compressor belt. The drag of the SC will take 30% of the motors power just to turn the unit.
1) Yes Superchargers TAKE power to MAKE power. However, in the end, a stock management JRSC on a d16a6 still puts out better numbers than a B16 swap, and has usable torque down low, unlike the torque less wonder that is the B16. It may be taking power to make power, but in the end it’s the numbers that speak for themselves.
2)JRSC have a bad rap because people are not smart enough to use them for what they were intended for. Those superchargers were built for daily driven street car for moderate boosts in performance. With a little creative engine management, you can get much better numbers than the ones advertised by JR. However, these superchargers will never be the Performance Godzilla’s that a proper turbo setup can provide. Again, that was not what they were built for, and the pricing of a GOOD turbo setup vs a JRSC reflects that.
3)If you are building a high horsepower straight line beast, or a high revving high horsepower vehicle that will mostly see high RPM race situations, a turbo is your best bet. For day to day driving and mountain runs, generally superchargers are fun and inexpensive setups. Plus they are California legal!
4)Last, for my own purposes, I am building a supercharged D16A6 for my current 91 Civic hatch, and this entire motor setup will eventually be swapped in the wagon (if I ever get one, and the turbo motor is ready for the Hatch). In my eyes, the wagon is a fun daily driven UTILITY vehicle, and I would much rather have some usable torque down low, how about you? Turbo setups just cannot provide that well enough for my taste.
Also, I think 30% Parasitic loss is a pretty high estimation on this one, but we get the general idea.
Nuff said, my 2 cents.
if you run an IC on a supercharger theres mad pressure loss.
But yeah, street driven car that wants corners... for me that means supercharger...
On #3, yes it is easy to make a high hp beast with turbo, BUT its also easy to make a stong lowend power car as well. the first turbo car we built as a shop was a 89 hatch with a ls. First dyno pull we did put 239 hp and 211 trq at about 10lbs. This was with a nice small WRX turbo. We were at full boost by 2100 rpms. A SC isnt going to do any better than that. Sure it ran out of power pretty quick, but we didnt build the car for drag (even though it ran 13.1 first time I ran the car, and I cant dragrace at all). We built it for autox and for the first year we drove the car, it had top time of the day at at least half the races that year, for door slammers anyway.
Ok, now I never bashed SC's. They are a great source of power for less than a turbo setup (new vs new anyway). However, the shop I work at does lots of custom forced setups. Wether it be Superchargers or Turbos. We do lots of base runs to test actual hp gains. So far the SC setups have been dissapointing for the most part (for money spent).
We did put a Procharger on a smallblock Ford in a 85 RX7 thats putting down some really good numbers, but it cost soooo much to get those numbers. Now for the custom turbo setup we are getting awesome results from all weve done. Including fours, sixes (inline and V), and eights. Best results have definatly been on the straight sixes, but the eight kits weve done have done well too.
Most people dont know anything about sizing turbos. It is very possible to get good low end power with a turbo. Its all about the sizing and of course the tuning.
hahaha tuning is key with any set up you will blow things up every time when you fly by the seat of your pants ... but with the super charger atleast vortech and jackson i think they make all provisions for fuel timing ect. and they stand behind there products
I Generally know enough to get me by. What I am saying is that on a super charger setup, I can build a low boost charger setup that will give me good low end TOURQE, somthing you generally wont find in a turbo setup. Yes you can build a custom setup using a smaller turbo, and or a hybrid, and yes, theturbo lag argument really is becoming a thing of the past. However, having a nice Tourqe number from the get go is what super chargers are all about. And if youve driven the winding mountian roads with both setups, I like the feel of the supercharger on the 4 banger more than the turbo setup, in the situation (at least on the way up!).
For me, again, its what your looking to do. A fun daily runner with no REAL tuning on low boost (yes, a wide band is Manditory, for ANY forced induction), super charge me please. High horse power, high reving (what turbos are GREAT at) turbo all the way.
What Im saying is, most poeple start talking about how turbos are so much better without really looking at what they are talking about. But to each his own, build what you want and have FUN with it. Thats the main thing! :!: