I decided to do the seat cut out myself as it was going to be a bit tricky and a design as you go job. I made a decent start on Saturday and thought 3-4 hours on Sunday would get it done. Well, it turned into a real mission.
As well as keeping the 8 year old entertained, I had problems welding the original floor pan (under 1mm) to the new panel (1.6mm). Some parts were definitely thinner than others, plus there was some double and triple skinning on the tunnel. Maybe it has something to do with metal strength when being pressed.
Got the panel in and fully welded. Not as tidy as I wanted, but passable. Still need to add another skin underneath to mount the seat belt fixing bolt but that's a job for another day. Seat fits in perfectly. Bang on centre and has room for front and back adjustment.
Still thinking about sliders as we plan to do a few enduros, but plenty of room as the seat needs to be raised 30mm to see out the front window. Just need sliders with no slop. Can't find FIA approved sliders anywhere. Purchased a set of sliders from Sabelt NZ a few months ago thinking they would be something high end, but just the same cheapies everyone else sells. The drivers seat getting loose in a big accident is always a worry.
Trying to push on and get the roll cage done. Before we can start we need to get the drivers seat position fully sorted, which means we need to make a decision on if we are going to use adjustable seat runners or not.
The Racetech seat should run with a fixed shoulder support so if we go with any adjustment we need to build an adjustable sliding shoulder support and build the cage to fit this as well. We did this on the FD2R Spoon rebuild so will so will use something similar.
The other part of the equation is the steering column which mounts to the front cross bar. This needs to be mocked up to ensure it will fit under the OEM dash panel.
We have decided to use a Woodward column and modify it to fit. Found a good used one on Ebay and its on it's way now We have used these before and the build quality is very high. We couldn't build one for the price that they can be purchased for used. Most of the columns for sale are ex Nascar and have done a season plus they are easy to strip and rebuild As soon as it arrived we can get it mocked up in the car.
Still deciding on a steering wheel but leaning towards a small diameter Momo one – around 280mm diametre.
Originally we were going to use the standard EF column and modify this, but after stripping it and seeing the size of the shaft and bearings, it went in the scrap bin.
Al's view on driver safety is get the best products you can, even if you have to buy used, so we won't be skimping in this area.
While we wait for the steering column to arrive from USA we need to make a start on the driver's seat mounts.
After much discussion we have decided not to use adjustable runners. Mainly for safety reasons. We have decided to weld in two steel box sections then drill and weld in taped studs to fix the Racetech side mount brackets. This will give us a solid mount with some adjustment. We just wont be able to run short and tall drivers in an enduro.
This is another job that involves a bit of work. Particularly as the inner rail passes through the end of the drop panel we have just fitted, and attaches to the OEM seat bracket but under the floor pan.
Inner rail cut and ready to be welded in:
Have to get the seat belt eyes in before we weld the seat bar in. Bar is a tight fit through the panel. The blue maker makes it look like a gap!! Right hand side bar tomorrow night.
The driver's seat cut out panel left us with no left side seat belt mount, so it needed a reinforcing patch plus the original threaded plate, slightly modified to fit.
With the two seat support rails tacked in place, we mocked up the seat to check for the placement of the main hoop. It's going to be well back in the middle of the rear door. The driver's elbow lines up with the B pillar!
We had to fit the seat higher than we originally though as front vision was obscured. The seat was set up by Al and he likes plenty of layback. For shorties it can be squared up and slid forward. Real shorties may have problems reaching the pedals but we may be putting these on an adjustable slider.
Our shocks have finally arrived. They are from a company that Al has done testing for in the past. They are sold under the Tomei brand. These are EF specific plus they are the prototype of the new 2 way adjustable range for EF, EG, EK, DC2 and DC5. Spherical top mounts and soon to be fitted spherical bottom mounts on the rear. Progressive bump stops and the correct bump travel for the chassis. They have a flexible adjuster cable coming out of the bottom of the shock for bump and rebound is in the normal position on the top of the shaft. The factory have a selection of spring rates to test on. Al ran the same shocks in a one way adjustable version on the Honda Cup pace car Shuttle and he was very happy with these after he had some changes made to the valving. The shock dyno graphs for the two ways look good. Will try and scan them so we can post them up.
All going well these shocks will be available to Honda Cup racers in April. Pricing with race rate springs will be very close to the price racers are paying for one way adjustables now.
Another part just arrived, this one from Hardrace for Al to check and test. They are new spherical steering rod ends with bump steer adjustment. EF specific but will fit EG
and DC2. Look well made and good to see a dust cover on the bearing.
We will fit these and check the bump steer curve once we get all the suspension back together. These are available now from Rworks.
These are version #2 as the first set Al tested had insufficient thread where they attach to the steering rack, and it's taken a few months to get them redone.
Al told me he has found that many Asian manufactured parts for Hondas are checked on local market cars, and he has found that the Taiwan local market single cam EG and EK chassis are different in many areas of the suspension to our NZDM and JDM EG and EK. Many parts when first released just don't fit! The USDM parts also differ quite a bit. Steering rack bushes are a good example... think there are 5 different combination of bush sizes depending on original market origin and model.
We have a full set of ITR 4 stud RTA's and a new set of 5 stud hubs, so it's time to strip the ITR RTA's down and see if our conversion plan will work. Have read quite a few posts on converting Shuttle rears to discs and they all seem to end up with bad looking welded on caliper mounts etc.
Our plan is to use the ITR stub axle with the caliper mount and adapt it to the Shuttle trailing arm. All the bolt holes line up, but the ITR stub axles is shorter than the Shuttle one on the inner mount. We can either modify the RTA or modify the stub axle. Time for a decision on this one. Al can decide!
ITR stubs are shorter on the inner and longer on the outer. See below:
We are also working on the front lower arms and fitting spherical inner and shock absorber bearings. We found some Hardrace shock mounts from another kit that will fit nicely and a pair of chromoly rod ends have arrived so now it is time to get on with the job. Some fabrication and welding is required to fit a threaded female piece on the inner ends of the bottom arms. Obviously this job needs to be done properly as it handles a high load so we will pass that on to Al as well.
Al has made the call. On the rear he is going to machine and press a ring onto the back of the ITR stub axle so it matches the hole in the outer side of the Shuttle RTA, plus modify the inner side of the Shuttle RTA to accommodate the shorter shaft on the ITR stub axles. Always better with pictures!
Rear trailing arm mod:
Spacer ready to weld in:
Don't worry, the other end is welded on the other side!
Hubs fitted identical track to the Shuttle setup:
16x8" in full bump position, new Rota Titan wheels fitted:
Yes we know it's a race car not a street car, but hot laps and taking punters for rides is all part of Motorsport promotion these days. Al has weakened and he is going to fit a shotgun seat, but it is definitely going to be coming out for racing.
Back to Racetech and this time it's a basic 1000 model. Still FIA approved and probably better than most of the competitor's mid range pieces.
Again it's going to be tricky to mount as it looks like we may have to run our second muffler (to stay under 95dB) in a box behind the passengers seat.
Won't go into detail, but with our two 30 litre fuel cells there is not sufficient room to run a 3 inch pipe between them. Plus we like the idea of a Nascar exhaust existing out the sill!
The plan is to run two 30 litre cells with one being removed for sprint races. It's going to be a tight fit between the chassis rails but we can do it!
Nothing suitable available off the shelf so it is a DIY job. We are retaining the front tension struts (traction bars) as we can't change these under Honda Cup rules, so it's not really worth all the trouble fabricating a complete bottom arm.
We searched all the Hardrace sphericals and found that a stock DC2 part fitted the shock bush. The inners need a bit of fabrication work so we could fit adjustable sphericals. This gives us some track variation options. We are running with high quality USA made spherical joints in this high load area. We are also going to increase the size of the through bolt in the crossmember.
Just so you guys don't think we have completely gone to sleep here are a few pictures of the cage – almost finished plus the cromoly rear crossmember. A lot of work has gone into this as the first time with any chassis requires a bit of trial and error.
You will see we are keeping the OEM door cards plus the OEM dash pad will still bolt in around the cage to it's original mounts. Gotta have that retro look.
We have the engine and gearbox ready for a mock up of the Hasport mounts but as the car is RHD the rear mount is going to require some fab work to fit.
With Honda Cup winter, prizegiving and sorting the summer series we have been little stretched to spend much time on the Skuttle project.
Things are moving along, just a little slower than we expected!
Cage is done as is the new cromoly rear crossmember. I think we spent more time on getting the crossmember sorted than we did on the cage.
The original dash has had some more cutting and is easily fitted and removed. The central fresh air is operational plus we have a working demister via the OEM ducts.
The rear suspension has been in and out quite a few times and we are on the fourth version of the new shocks. Rear bodies ended up needed shortening again and think we have the spring rates sorted.
Our new ATS front brake package is all fitted up. Because were are using EF uprights and 98 DC2r hubs we had to modify the offset a little, but it gave us the chance to make up some proper locating rings for the rims.
The ATS calipers are extremely well made with radial mounting. By the look of them flex will not be an issue!
Our home made rear wing is all done and fitted. Not sure how effective it will be as we still have the OEM rear screen duct fitted under the wing. Only testing will tell!
Honda Cup allows rims of a max size of 17x8, so this is what we are running and we just got them to fit running the wide 235 17 slicks on the front.
The engine and gearbox have been in for a test fit and we have modified the rear cross member for gearbox and header clearance. Being RHD and having power steer makes it a lot tighter, plus being a race car we need some extra clearance so we can get the engine in and out without any hassles. Once we pull the engine again we will refab the crossmembers. The rear is due for some extra bracing.
We did think the Shuttle would have more hood clearance than an EF... but the across the top shot shows we are going to have to do some serious cutting here!
Thanks for updating, progress looks amazing! What class will this be running in as some of the mods seem to contradict a few of the rules I know of Honda Cup (rear wing above roofline, modified rear subframe etc unless I have the rules mixed up?)
Slowly progressing fitting out the race truck good things take time!!!
Alert Motorsport supporters of Honda Cup and stockists of many leading brands of Motorsport parts supplied the Pipercross filter and backing plate form the ITBs (rated at 300hp) and the quality setrab engine oil cooler. We are also running a water to oil cooler for the gearbox also from Alert.
The remote filter that takes a Fram HP4 has a trick priming system so you can ensure the cooler loop is full of oil before firing the engine. Also the Rworks modified vent bottle with 2x dash 12 male fittings.
Also a close up of the ATS brake system these from Rworks NZ. Real quality product that takes an AP size pad.
These match up with OEM Type R discs and calipers on the rear. Who said these wont fit onto a Skuttle!!!
Comments
I'll let the builder of the car answer this when he comes on here. He's a pretty busy man though! I'm just the promo guy
All will be revealed very soon... it's a custom built affair though!
Yup, I'm also helping run the Honda Cup racing series, so I'm doing what I can when time is available
I decided to do the seat cut out myself as it was going to be a bit tricky and a design as you go job. I made a decent start on Saturday and thought 3-4 hours on Sunday would get it done. Well, it turned into a real mission.
As well as keeping the 8 year old entertained, I had problems welding the original floor pan (under 1mm) to the new panel (1.6mm). Some parts were definitely thinner than others, plus there was some double and triple skinning on the tunnel. Maybe it has something to do with metal strength when being pressed.
Got the panel in and fully welded. Not as tidy as I wanted, but passable. Still need to add another skin underneath to mount the seat belt fixing bolt but that's a job for another day. Seat fits in perfectly. Bang on centre and has room for front and back adjustment.
Still thinking about sliders as we plan to do a few enduros, but plenty of room as the seat needs to be raised 30mm to see out the front window. Just need sliders with no slop. Can't find FIA approved sliders anywhere. Purchased a set of sliders from Sabelt NZ a few months ago thinking they would be something high end, but just the same cheapies everyone else sells. The drivers seat getting loose in a big accident is always a worry.
8 year old entertaining himself with the MIG:
Done, and test fitting seat:
7pm and home time:
The Racetech seat should run with a fixed shoulder support so if we go with any adjustment we need to build an adjustable sliding shoulder support and build the cage to fit this as well. We did this on the FD2R Spoon rebuild so will so will use something similar.
The other part of the equation is the steering column which mounts to the front cross bar. This needs to be mocked up to ensure it will fit under the OEM dash panel.
We have decided to use a Woodward column and modify it to fit. Found a good used one on Ebay and its on it's way now We have used these before and the build quality is very high. We couldn't build one for the price that they can be purchased for used. Most of the columns for sale are ex Nascar and have done a season plus they are easy to strip and rebuild As soon as it arrived we can get it mocked up in the car.
Still deciding on a steering wheel but leaning towards a small diameter Momo one – around 280mm diametre.
Originally we were going to use the standard EF column and modify this, but after stripping it and seeing the size of the shaft and bearings, it went in the scrap bin.
Al's view on driver safety is get the best products you can, even if you have to buy used, so we won't be skimping in this area.
After much discussion we have decided not to use adjustable runners. Mainly for safety reasons. We have decided to weld in two steel box sections then drill and weld in taped studs to fix the Racetech side mount brackets. This will give us a solid mount with some adjustment. We just wont be able to run short and tall drivers in an enduro.
This is another job that involves a bit of work. Particularly as the inner rail passes through the end of the drop panel we have just fitted, and attaches to the OEM seat bracket but under the floor pan.
Inner rail cut and ready to be welded in:
Have to get the seat belt eyes in before we weld the seat bar in. Bar is a tight fit through the panel. The blue maker makes it look like a gap!! Right hand side bar tomorrow night.
Done checked and tacked:
With the two seat support rails tacked in place, we mocked up the seat to check for the placement of the main hoop. It's going to be well back in the middle of the rear door. The driver's elbow lines up with the B pillar!
We had to fit the seat higher than we originally though as front vision was obscured. The seat was set up by Al and he likes plenty of layback. For shorties it can be squared up and slid forward. Real shorties may have problems reaching the pedals but we may be putting these on an adjustable slider.
Our shocks have finally arrived. They are from a company that Al has done testing for in the past. They are sold under the Tomei brand. These are EF specific plus they are the prototype of the new 2 way adjustable range for EF, EG, EK, DC2 and DC5. Spherical top mounts and soon to be fitted spherical bottom mounts on the rear. Progressive bump stops and the correct bump travel for the chassis. They have a flexible adjuster cable coming out of the bottom of the shock for bump and rebound is in the normal position on the top of the shaft. The factory have a selection of spring rates to test on. Al ran the same shocks in a one way adjustable version on the Honda Cup pace car Shuttle and he was very happy with these after he had some changes made to the valving. The shock dyno graphs for the two ways look good. Will try and scan them so we can post them up.
All going well these shocks will be available to Honda Cup racers in April. Pricing with race rate springs will be very close to the price racers are paying for one way adjustables now.
Another part just arrived, this one from Hardrace for Al to check and test. They are new spherical steering rod ends with bump steer adjustment. EF specific but will fit EG
and DC2. Look well made and good to see a dust cover on the bearing.
We will fit these and check the bump steer curve once we get all the suspension back together. These are available now from Rworks.
These are version #2 as the first set Al tested had insufficient thread where they attach to the steering rack, and it's taken a few months to get them redone.
Al told me he has found that many Asian manufactured parts for Hondas are checked on local market cars, and he has found that the Taiwan local market single cam EG and EK chassis are different in many areas of the suspension to our NZDM and JDM EG and EK. Many parts when first released just don't fit! The USDM parts also differ quite a bit. Steering rack bushes are a good example... think there are 5 different combination of bush sizes depending on original market origin and model.
Our plan is to use the ITR stub axle with the caliper mount and adapt it to the Shuttle trailing arm. All the bolt holes line up, but the ITR stub axles is shorter than the Shuttle one on the inner mount. We can either modify the RTA or modify the stub axle. Time for a decision on this one. Al can decide!
ITR stubs are shorter on the inner and longer on the outer. See below:
We are also working on the front lower arms and fitting spherical inner and shock absorber bearings. We found some Hardrace shock mounts from another kit that will fit nicely and a pair of chromoly rod ends have arrived so now it is time to get on with the job. Some fabrication and welding is required to fit a threaded female piece on the inner ends of the bottom arms. Obviously this job needs to be done properly as it handles a high load so we will pass that on to Al as well.
Al has made the call. On the rear he is going to machine and press a ring onto the back of the ITR stub axle so it matches the hole in the outer side of the Shuttle RTA, plus modify the inner side of the Shuttle RTA to accommodate the shorter shaft on the ITR stub axles. Always better with pictures!
Rear trailing arm mod:
Spacer ready to weld in:
Don't worry, the other end is welded on the other side!
Hubs fitted identical track to the Shuttle setup:
16x8" in full bump position, new Rota Titan wheels fitted:
Plenty of clearance for a race slick!!!
Back to Racetech and this time it's a basic 1000 model. Still FIA approved and probably better than most of the competitor's mid range pieces.
Again it's going to be tricky to mount as it looks like we may have to run our second muffler (to stay under 95dB) in a box behind the passengers seat.
Won't go into detail, but with our two 30 litre fuel cells there is not sufficient room to run a 3 inch pipe between them. Plus we like the idea of a Nascar exhaust existing out the sill!
The plan is to run two 30 litre cells with one being removed for sprint races. It's going to be a tight fit between the chassis rails but we can do it!
We searched all the Hardrace sphericals and found that a stock DC2 part fitted the shock bush. The inners need a bit of fabrication work so we could fit adjustable sphericals. This gives us some track variation options. We are running with high quality USA made spherical joints in this high load area. We are also going to increase the size of the through bolt in the crossmember.
On the bench ready to weld together:
You will see we are keeping the OEM door cards plus the OEM dash pad will still bolt in around the cage to it's original mounts. Gotta have that retro look.
We have the engine and gearbox ready for a mock up of the Hasport mounts but as the car is RHD the rear mount is going to require some fab work to fit.
Things are moving along, just a little slower than we expected!
Cage is done as is the new cromoly rear crossmember. I think we spent more time on getting the crossmember sorted than we did on the cage.
The original dash has had some more cutting and is easily fitted and removed. The central fresh air is operational plus we have a working demister via the OEM ducts.
The rear suspension has been in and out quite a few times and we are on the fourth version of the new shocks. Rear bodies ended up needed shortening again and think we have the spring rates sorted.
Our new ATS front brake package is all fitted up. Because were are using EF uprights and 98 DC2r hubs we had to modify the offset a little, but it gave us the chance to make up some proper locating rings for the rims.
The ATS calipers are extremely well made with radial mounting. By the look of them flex will not be an issue!
Our home made rear wing is all done and fitted. Not sure how effective it will be as we still have the OEM rear screen duct fitted under the wing. Only testing will tell!
Honda Cup allows rims of a max size of 17x8, so this is what we are running and we just got them to fit running the wide 235 17 slicks on the front.
The engine and gearbox have been in for a test fit and we have modified the rear cross member for gearbox and header clearance. Being RHD and having power steer makes it a lot tighter, plus being a race car we need some extra clearance so we can get the engine in and out without any hassles. Once we pull the engine again we will refab the crossmembers. The rear is due for some extra bracing.
We did think the Shuttle would have more hood clearance than an EF... but the across the top shot shows we are going to have to do some serious cutting here!
Alert Motorsport supporters of Honda Cup and stockists of many leading brands of Motorsport parts supplied the Pipercross filter and backing plate form the ITBs (rated at 300hp) and the quality setrab engine oil cooler. We are also running a water to oil cooler for the gearbox also from Alert.
The remote filter that takes a Fram HP4 has a trick priming system so you can ensure the cooler loop is full of oil before firing the engine. Also the Rworks modified vent bottle with 2x dash 12 male fittings.
Also a close up of the ATS brake system these from Rworks NZ. Real quality product that takes an AP size pad.
These match up with OEM Type R discs and calipers on the rear. Who said these wont fit onto a Skuttle!!!